17-year-old unarmed black teen shot by "neighborhood guardian"

Hey, I'm very empathetic to him too.
 
Ornithologist Mario said:
Hey, I'm very empathetic to him too.
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You can't empathize with him if you've never been shot. You can only sympathize. Learn the difference!
 
A teacher was fired from her job for helping her students understand the Trayvon Martin situation:

http://www.change.org/petitions/fired-for-teaching-about-trayvon-re-hire-brooke-harris-at-pontiac-academy-for-excellence

What's this world coming to?
 
Smashgoom202 said:
A teacher was fired from her job for helping her students understand the Trayvon Martin situation:

http://www.change.org/petitions/fired-for-teaching-about-trayvon-re-hire-brooke-harris-at-pontiac-academy-for-excellence

What's this world coming to?
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Yep because i'm sure that was the only thing that happened
 
It looks like Zimmerman has finally turned himself in, and is charged with 2nd degree murder:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57412675/zimmerman-charged-with-2nd-degree-murder/
 
If he really was defending himself from Trayvon (because he pissed Trayvon off it the first place by following him and racially profiling him) couldn't zimmerman of just shot him in the leg or in the arm or something? That would have stopped the conflict without killing him, his arm just would have been in a sling or his leg in a cast for a few weeks.
 
Not necessarily. Any bullet wound can be fatal. Besides, unless he's a world-class sharpshooter, his aim might not be perfect.
 
Smashgoom202 said:
A teacher was fired from her job for helping her students understand the Trayvon Martin situation:

http://www.change.org/petitions/fired-for-teaching-about-trayvon-re-hire-brooke-harris-at-pontiac-academy-for-excellence

What's this world coming to?
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tBMSI.jpg


I guess what they say about "'murika" is true
 
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/13/19441838-jury-finds-george-zimmerman-not-guilty?lite

...George Zimmerman found not guilty...

...Take it away, Bugs.

 
I just made a really long post on another forum, justifying why I felt George Zimmerman was entirely in the wrong for what he did. I'm going to copy-paste what I wrote for you guys to read:
Okay, I'm not going to reply directly to Geckoblitz's reply, because I feel that backing-and-forthing will go nowhere... Not to mention, I'd like to apologize for any stupid things I said during that time. I was incredibly upset and irrational, not to mention, I have this thing where I'm never sure of what I say, nor can I be certain of my convictions. There are people out there, people I sometimes envy, that can say things with certainty, even if they're blatantly wrong or angry, and still come off looking like they said the right thing. I was hoping to channel that sort of thing, but I failed utterly and it looks like I upset some people in the process.

With that said, I've thought about what's been said since last night, and I'd like to clarify some things, in as well-mannered a way as possible. I will also like to note that this is all entirely based on what I know, so if I'm missing a few details, PLEASE, link me with something instead of just saying I'm wrong, because I want to know the hardcore facts of this case. BTW, I realize that I wasn't posting any links to back myself up, mostly because I didn't have the links on me, but when people are telling me something I've never heard about, saying that it's obvious and everywhere, I'd LIKE to be shown an official report of such a claim before I just take your word for it. Because I will totally own up to being wrong, if I am.

Anyway, with all that said...

Having looked up a bit of the case, I will say that Trayvon Martin wasn't COMPLETELY innocent. Apparently, he's been suspended from his school 3 times, though none of those times were from any kind of violence. The first time was for graffiti; the second time was being in possession of a woman's stolen jewelry, which he said he got from a friend. Third time was being in possession of a marijuana pipe with marijuana residue on it. So clearly, Trayvon Martin wasn't exactly an angel.

...That being said, I still think George Zimmerman is guilty, for the following reasons. First and foremost, the self-defense argument:

For me, plain and simple, using your fists does not have the same lethality as a gun. Using a gun to to fend off a fist-fight is like using a cannon to fend off a particularly violent raccoon (please excuse the accidental racial implication there). Of course, this ties back to the "Stand Your Ground" law in Flordia, which I don't at all agree with and I'll get to in a moment. Even if it was "self-defense", it was still overkill in every meaning of the word.

I'm also of the opinion, as I alluded to before, that looking "suspicious" does not justify Zimmerman's actions in the slightest. He informed the police, they told him not to follow him, he should of followed their orders instead of going out on his own and getting himself attacked and into this whole mess. If Trayvon Martin truly was dangerous-looking, as Zimmerman said, he should have let the police handle it instead of taking actions into his own hands. I realize he was on the "neighborhood watch". That doesn't make it okay to go against what the police tell you to do and get yourself into a situation like Zimmerman did.

But as for the whole "Trayvon looked suspicious" argument... I'm going to go off of what I know and what I've been told for this one. So, supposedly, Trayvon Martin was drunk at the time. Can I please have an official report of this. From what I've read, his autopsy said no alcohol was in his body, lease none that I could tell (I'm terrible at chemistry and what components means what). What it DID say was that there was "trace levels of THC, the active ingredient in marijuana, in his blood and urine":

http://healthland.time.com/2012/05/18/traces-of-marijuana-found-in-trayvon-martins-body-does-it-matter-2/

http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/18/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Well now we're getting somewhere. Apparently, Trayvon WAS under the influence of a reality-leaving drug... But here's the thing: drugs can change your personality, but WHICH drug you use can make all the difference. I've never been there before, but from what I've seen, being drunk is a might different from being high. Doing marijuana will have different effects compared to if you used meth. If we're so caught up in the details to defend Zimmerman's actions, then I'd say arguing about how effected Trayvon was is also worth arguing here. Because from what I can tell, marijuana typically makes you more relaxed then violent... Unless you start seeing things and getting nervous or whatever. The effects of drugs also depend on the person as well.

I would also like to add that if more people were involved, i.e., if Trayvon was harassing someone, or if it looked like Trayvon was going to do something incredibly dangerous, then I might be more inclined to believe that Zimmerman might of had a right to be suspicious. But there wasn't anything. The only parties involved were Trayvon and Zimmerman. Not to mention, I can't imagine what harm Trayvon would do with a bag of Skittles and his bare fists.

Yes, Zimmerman was beat up pretty badly, but he didn't DIE the same way Trayvon Martin died by Zimmerman's gun. Which brings me back to the "Stand Your Ground" law in it's effects in Florida... I actually watched a special report on television (yes, I know, the media, just bare with me for a moment) that said since it's implication in Flordia, death rates have only increased, and has hardly any kind of positive effect on the crime there. Perhaps there was a positive effect, but in this case, it's shown to be a very easily abused law... Where someone can tract someone else down with a gun for "looking suspicious", and get away with it by saying it was "self-defense"... And really, can you blame Trayvon Martin for picking a fight with someone who was following him with a gun? Sure, most people would run at the sight of someone with a gun, but as we've said before, Trayvon was under the influence of marijuana, if the traces of it in his body are to be believed. He likely was not thinking straight, or didn't have a firm grasp on the situation.

Maybe that doesn't matter, though. Maybe his supposed "attack" on Zimmerman can't be justified. Well I'm of the opinion that using a GUN against someone who only had his fists to fight can't be justified either. Do you realize how long it would take to KILL someone just using your bare fists? BY YOURSELF? Okay, getting a little intense there, forgive me...

Point is, with a clear mind, and the information that I have on me, I can't see George Zimmerman being in any way "in the right" for his actions, and it's why I think this "Not Guilty" verdict is an atrocity. You may not agree, you may in fact call me stupid for not being as "informed", and maybe I AM missing something, but from what I've read, from my perspective, Zimmerman is, and will always be, guilty...


But like Nedcone, Trayvon and Zimmerman were both idiots, Zimmerman for doing what he did, and Trayvon for getting high and doing bad things himself. All in all, I don't want to talk about this anymore. So with that, I will do as Kinvara and never post on this topic again.
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I might just never post on this topic either, because I hate being reminded of this. I was going to see Pacific Rim today, and hearing about the ruling of this case, and hearing about it constantly and having all these discussions and debates, it's putting me in a foul mood... And I don't want to be like that, because it makes me act mean and irrational, and I don't want to be like that.
 
Somehow, I feel like I should be offended by that statement, but honestly, I don't care anymore.
 
in what way would you be offended

all i'm saying is that a local murder trial shouldn't be on national news, covering up more important stuff like political shenanigans in egypt and snowden's attempts to find asylum
 
Viridi said:
and... your point is?

one possible hate crime is more important than anything else happening in the world?
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one person can make a difference, you shouldnt really just shun away one, if you did then we'd shun all of them

imo it sounds like u dont even give a fuck about this event that happened
 
i mean sure, zimmerman should have been convicted for manslaughter. or something like that.

but i mean putting this trial above everything else that's happening in the world? why?

am i heartless for not caring about this as much as political activity in egypt and what exactly the united states government is willing to do to catch snowden
 
I can't help but agree with Javelin. A murder/manslaughter/whatever is small beans compared to what's happening politically both nationally and globally.
 
I agree with Javelin from the start I thought this was a fake news story and I continue to think this is a fake news story
 
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