The lack of Mario Party representation in the Super Smash Bros. series

winstein

winstein

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After I have posted an unpopular opinion on the "Unpopular opinions about the Super Smash Bros series." thread, I am inspired to create this topic on how Mario Party has a surprising sparse representation in the history of Super Smash Bros., starting by recapping the representation it got first:
- Super Smash Bros (Nintendo 64): * No representation that I can find (please correct me if you find any)
- Super Smash Bros Melee: * No representation that I can find (please correct me if you find any)
- Super Smash Bros Brawl: Ballyhoo and Big Top, Mentioned in Blooper's appearance (Mario Party 8 ), 18 stickers ranging from Mario Party 2 to Mario Party 8
- Super Smash Bros for 3DS: * No representation that I can find (please correct me if you find any)
- Super Smash Bros for Wii U: Mentioned in Toadsworth's appearance (Mario Party 7), Minigame Theme (Mario Party 9)

As you can see, Mario Party is sorely lacking in representation. Contrast this to other Mario spin-offs, which got their dues:
- Mario Kart: Has two stages, Trophies starting from Melee, music tracks starting from Brawl, Stickers in Brawl, Items, mentioned in Luigi's appearance in Smash 64
- Donkey Kong: Represented as own universe: Characters, Stages, Trophies, Music, Stickers, Items
- Mario Sports: Has moveset representation, Trophies starting from Melee, music tracks starting from Brawl, Stickers
- Yoshi: Represented as own universe: Character, Stages, Trophies, Music, Stickers
- Wario: Represented as own universe: Character, Stages, Trophies, Music, Stickers
- Paper Mario: Has one stage, Trophies starting from Melee, music tracks starting from 3DS/WiiU, Stickers
- Mario & Luigi: Music tracks starting from Brawl, Stickers in Brawl
- Dr. Mario: Has playable representation, Trophies starting from Melee, music tracks starting from Melee, one Sticker

From the spin-off list, Donkey Kong and Mario Kart have more sales than Mario Party, while the rest have less sales. However, you will notice right away that every other series have decent representation, with the least amount of it being Mario & Luigi, which still has better representation than Mario Party.

Now for my totally unsubstantiated theories on why Mario Party has no representation: let's go! Mario Party probably didn't get a lot of representation because there are few elements where one can look at, and scream "Mario Party!", which is why it lacked a lot of elements. It's also probable that people playing Smash Bros. aren't all that hot with Mario Party so there aren't representation. Maybe Mario Party can be seen as having too much of a competition with Smash Bros. so just some token elements were added. It might also be that several key developers aren't keen on the series so they didn't include too much of it. I guess it's also because the game series aren't deep enough to engage enough players to become fans. Basically if an interviewer reads this, please ask Sakurai or another Smash developer on why Mario Party lacks representation, unless Ultimate surprised us with a suitable representation.

Anyway, regardless on my unproven theories, I still feel that Mario Party is due for a huge representation. For those who lean on game sales for advocating character/series representation, you're going to love this one: Mario Party is the third-best selling Mario series, right behind Super Mario and Mario Kart (excluding Donkey Kong). If we're talking about impact, while it's certainly true that Mario Party is a very casual series, it still managed to generate some memorable experiences, and more important, it inspires imitators like Sonic Shuffle, Pac-Man Party and Disney's Party (Mickey Mouse). Moreover, Smash has been about celebrating Nintendo as a whole, and Mario Party shouldn't be underrepresented as it is.

What do you think: do you feel that Mario Party needs more representation, and reasons for your opinion?

Thank you for reading.
 
I'm definitely not a good authority on this, but I really don't see how it could be represented more than it has. Maybe a stage that transitions to several different minigames from throughout the series? Or maybe one of the boards? Otherwise what more can you ask for? A couple music tracks? A trophy?
 
An MC Ballyhoo assist trophy would be nice actually. Have him make candy fly out of big top, each having a different effect on any fighter who touches one.

Outside of that though, I don't know what they could do.

If MC Ballyhoo doesn't work, though, they still have Tumble or Brighton and Twila.
 
Moldomré said:
I'm definitely not a good authority on this, but I really don't see how it could be represented more than it has. Maybe a stage that transitions to several different minigames from throughout the series? Or maybe one of the boards? Otherwise what more can you ask for? A couple music tracks? A trophy?
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It should be very easy to represent the series much more then it already is, take a look at Mario Kart and the Mario RPGs:
-Mario Kart: Best-Selling Mario Spin-Off Series, over 100 million copies sold.
-In Smash: Three Stages, Twelve songs and 14 Trophies.
-Mario RPGs: Fourth Best-Selling Mario Spin-Off Series, 16 million copies sold (including Mario + Rabbids: Kingdom Battle).
-In Smash: One Stage, Four Songs and 23 Trophies.

Now take a look at Mario Party:
-Mario Party: Second Best-Selling Mario Spin-Off series, over 30 million copies sold.
-In Smash: No Stages, a Song and a Trophy.

Mario Party could easily get all of the things the other Spin-Off Series get, and I'm hoping that it's gets that treatment in Ultimate.
 
I personally think Smash just doesn't care for spin off material in general. Pokemon Mystery Dungeon and Ranger games get no content, and I highly doubt we'll see anything from Hyrule Warriors, which is a shame. HW Impa as a completely original fighter would be so cool.

The only real exceptions are Mario Kart and Mario RPGs. The former makes sense because Mario Kart by itself is a massive and important franchise. The RPGs are so distinct from the main Mario universe that I say they warrant recognition. I guess you could argue Luigi's Mansion as well, but those games have always sat in weird place to me. They are spin-offs but they're so distinct. Party though? There's not much there of interest.

I'm not counting DK, Yoshi, or Wario here since they are all pretty much their own franchises.

So I think this is simply a case of other Mario spin-offs just being considered less important in the grand scheme of things. But hey, at least they get music. Mystery Dungeon hasn't gotten any content at all, and that's a travesty.
 
Deku said:
I personally think Smash just doesn't care for spin off material in general. Pokemon Mystery Dungeon and Ranger games get no content, and I highly doubt we'll see anything from Hyrule Warriors, which is a shame. HW Impa as a completely original fighter would be so cool.

The only real exceptions are Mario Kart and Mario RPGs. The former makes sense because Mario Kart by itself is a massive and important franchise. The RPGs are so distinct from the main Mario universe that I say they warrant recognition. I guess you could argue Luigi's Mansion as well, but those games have always sat in weird place to me. They are spin-offs but they're so distinct. Party though? There's not much there of interest.

I'm not counting DK, Yoshi, or Wario here since they are all pretty much their own franchises.

So I think this is simply a case of other Mario spin-offs just being considered less important in the grand scheme of things. But hey, at least they get music. Mystery Dungeon hasn't gotten any content at all, and that's a travesty.
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Super Mario Bros. was basically a spin-off that grew quite big that it basically became the main series, so I don't think spin-offs are something to write off.

I am not sure Pokemon is an indication for spin-offs not mattering, only because for one, Pokemon, while it's a large property, is not fully first-party (only two out of three of the owners are Nintendo-based), and two, I heard that The Pokemon Company have some restrictions with the Pokemon property (for example, Super Mario Maker only used Pokemon sound effects on the starters but not the other Smash-based Pokemon like Pikachu). It's plausible that The Pokemon Company wants to restrict Pokemon representation to the main games, which would explain the lack of spin-off presence.

While I can see your point on Mario Party not being distinct, since this is a series that takes after Super Mario quite a lot, I still feel that Mario Party is overdue for something to represent the games in a bigger way than its current state. Perhaps an item, a board based on one of the boards or minigames, and/or even more music. Besides, it's not like Mario Party is a small and unimportant spin-off. It provided something unique as a party game, and it's even long-running, which is no small feat for party games! Certainly it's not Mario Kart-big, but it has been one of Nintendo's reliable franchises given that it's got regular releases save for the dry spell between DS and 9.

Thank you for reading.
 
Tbh, I think the Mario Party series can make a very very interesting stage with lots of potential. It could function like WarioWare, except you're on a board where many events happen, and then the stage transitions to a minigame where you can collect coins or avoid flying Bullet Bills. Also, I would love to hear a medley of different minigame music compiled into one, as well as rearrangements of some board music for Super Smash Bros.

As items, you can fling orbs as traps into the ground, like Motion Sensor Bombs or Pitifalls, and effects can occur when a player steps over it dependent on the character featured inside the orb. Or you can eat candy from Mario Party 8 to transform yourself into a vampire or Bullet Bill (though this could be tricky to pull off, all the Tanooki and Rocket Packs did was attach a separate model part to a character's model, this overhauls some parts of the characters model outright).

Arguably, I don't think the Mario RPGs are any more distinct than Mario Party, though I might be heavily biased as a large Mario Party fan myself.
 
Mario Party's atmosphere makes me want the developers to ditch the "lel I'm so mad" persona of Mario, on the other hand, as well as the rubbish voices of Bowser, Luigi, Donkey, and Diddy, so when they get to play on their stages, the mood from those characters are there. But that being said, a stage can work pretty well, maybe in a similar vein to WarioWare, but the minigames are more elaborate. Maybe there are spaces scattered throughout the board. Maybe like in Golden Plains, you can collect coins by hitting lit-up spaces. Some spaces release items. And a minigame can play where you get more coins. Finally, if you collect a certain amount of coins, you can try hitting the Star Space for a powerful item (which mimics the 20 coins for a star). Or, Mario Party can come in the form of independent minigames such as the minigames in Special Mode, but they're clearly Mario Party-themed. Or you don't have to be literally on the board, the stage can also be a simple board where there's a dice block, fighters hit it, and you see Mario and friends in the background advancing through spaces in their car. Maybe they can be the hazard; if they land on a minigame space, a minigame begins. Or if Mario characters land on a happening space, stuff happens to YOU too.

Just throwing ideas out there, but they may make for an interesting stage.
 
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