All-Time Core Mario Games Ranked

[Lartisan]

Hi there, I'm new here and I hope this is the right place to post some questions/thoughts that I just could not come across anywhere else. So, about the eternal debate on the best all-time Mario game. I've seen countless of rankings out there, most of them essentially mixing apples with oranges. For example, comparing 2D games vs 3D ones or comparing games for handheld devices vs those created for TV consoles. Also, most of these rankings seems to be plagued with nostalgia, subjectivity, or simply lack of rigor. In light of that, I would like to propose a couple of different rankings for you to assess. I'm going to focus exclusively on core Mario games for tv consoles. Focusing on core Mario games leaves out games like Yoshi's Island or Mario Maker (not to mention Kart, Paper, RPG, etc). On the other hand, I prefer focusing on games for tv consoles only because it was not until the release of the Switch that tv consoles had a significant technological advantage over handheld devices. So, without any further due, here go my all-time rankings.

2D Core Mario Games for TV Consoles:

1- New Super Mario World U
2- New Super Mario World Wii
3- Super Mario World (by a tad)
4- Super Mario Bros 3
5- Super Mario Bros 2 (though I thought of not even including it)
6- Super Mario Bros


3D Core Mario Games for TV Consoles

1- Super Mario Odyssey
2- Super Mario Galaxy 2
3- Super Mario Galaxy
4- Super Mario 64 (if not fifth)
5- Super Mario Sunshine (potentially fourth)

Regarding the 2D ranking, note that the only reason why I included SMB2 here is because I noticed a very particular but stark resemblance with SMW. And that is regarding the sensitivity with which you control Mario. In both SMB2 and SMW Mario mimics exactly what you command him to do. There's instant acceleration and instant stopping. In all the other 2D games I mentioned above (especially starting with SMB3) there is some dragging while accelerating and some momentum before stopping -making Mario less responsive, less controlable, but giving him this distinctive "feel". Other than this, I see no reason why SMB2 should be part of this list -considering it was never conceived as a true Mario game.

You may also be thinking: "This guy is nutz. He cannot place NSMBU above SMW or SMB3". Well, this is actually one of the reasons why I took all this time to write this post. The short answer is that I truly think NSMBU is the best 2D game today in every aspect. The game came out 20+ years after SMW, giving it every possible advantage to be better. And it simply is. No matter how much less revolutionary, innovative, or impactful it could be. Just ask yourselves this question, if an alien landed on Earth tomorrow, which game do you think he/she would choose presented with these options?

Finally, you may have also noticed that I did not include Super Mario 3D World. I did this on purpose for at least two reasons. One is because I did not want to be that radically controversial. The other one is because I think it would have been a rather subjective choice. If I had included it, I would have probably placed it at the very top of the 2D list. Yes, 2D. But it could also probably be a category of its own, considering that it combines elements from all the other 2D and 3D games I included above. In my opinion, SM3DW incorporates the best of the two worlds. Levels have a linear progression and are short and packed with action (a feature I love about 2D games). But then the game adds amazingly creative 3D graphs on top of that. I'm sorry but that's a killer combo to me.

What do people think?

 

[Cayde]

this belongs in video games @Annie Eilenberg

 

[Goombuigi]

I think it would fit better in Marioverse, since the Video Games board is for discussing non-Mario games.

 

[Lartisan]

I think it would fit better in Marioverse, since the Video Games board is for discussing non-Mario games.

Thanks! This is very helpful!

 

[Ray Trace]

Also, most of these rankings seems to be plagued with...subjectivity

Simply put, there is no objectivity in game lists like this. Every single ranking that you see is subjective because it 100% plays a role on whether you like a game or not. Even if games aren't playable in a technical sense, you can like them more than other games for a myriad of reasons; like, they don't make me gamble for my favorite characters at the very least.

Super Mario World has so many issues today. One of its biggest problems is that it attempts to encourage exploration, but the timer walls you up every single time you want to find a secret exit, probably forcing you to do multiple playthroughs of levels because you can't do levels at your own pace, and not to mention, has some incredibly cryptic secret exits that require you use a guide to know where they are (such as Cheese Bridge and the Top Secret Area). Dragon coins are one of the most useless collectibles to be devised in the Mario series, the game doesn't even keep track of your progress getting them and their only reward is to give you 1-Ups, a game that already forcefeeds you 1-Ups at every opportunity. I also think saving might be outdated and the only way you can save the game is by beating a castle. Also, you can't even replay castles unless you press L and R at them. The GBA remake does fix a lot of these issues however, but it doesn't fix that dreadful and highly counterproductive timer.

In addition, Super Mario World isn't as nonlinear as it looks in the map. Most paths in the game are still one-track, there's not all that much branching paths. Its world map is a bit more dynamic than say, Super Mario Bros. 3's or New Super Mario Bros. but it wasn't like a highly explorative one. I think U attempted to recapture it but not sure why it didn't succeed as much as World did.

On a side note, I think gaming mags and game journalists and social media needs to stop lionizing video games, because it leads to this rather toxic mentality that you can't express an opposing opinion on a game that's otherwise critically acclaimed, because there's something "wrong" with you for not liking this video game as much as this other video game. You shouldn't be afraid to state that you like New Super Mario Bros. U more than the likes of 3 and World, because it's fine. I like Yoshi's New Island more than Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island for similar reasons: I like the modern conveniences in New Island that the original lacks because it was a product of its time. The original IS still a fine damn good game however and I don't mean to disparage it and I understand where New Island took all of its inspiration from, it's just that I prefer New Island more as a more fun game overall because it was built upon that strong foundation.

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

I think U attempted to recapture it but not sure why it didn't succeed as much as World did.

It's because in the end, the worlds look self contained. Dino Island is one big island so it feels like you're exploring this island even though you can make out Yoshi's Island, Donut Plains, Vanilla Dome, and so on, but the worlds in U were just conjoined together. I like to have transition levels in the vein of Moskito levels in Rayman Origins, sure, but you don't see Forest of Illusions right after Vanilla Dome, separated by a castle or Fortress. You have to go through Butter Bridge and Cheese Bridge first (iirc).

 

[Lartisan]

Simply put, there is no objectivity in game lists like this. Every single ranking that you see is subjective because it 100% plays a role on whether you like a game or not. Even if games aren't playable in a technical sense, you can like them more than other games for a myriad of reasons; like, they don't make me gamble for my favorite characters at the very least.

Super Mario World has so many issues today. One of its biggest problems is that it attempts to encourage exploration, but the timer walls you up every single time you want to find a secret exit, probably forcing you to do multiple playthroughs of levels because you can't do levels at your own pace, and not to mention, has some incredibly cryptic secret exits that require you use a guide to know where they are (such as Cheese Bridge and the Top Secret Area). Dragon coins are one of the most useless collectibles to be devised in the Mario series, the game doesn't even keep track of your progress getting them and their only reward is to give you 1-Ups, a game that already forcefeeds you 1-Ups at every opportunity. I also think saving might be outdated and the only way you can save the game is by beating a castle. Also, you can't even replay castles unless you press L and R at them. The GBA remake does fix a lot of these issues however, but it doesn't fix that dreadful and highly counterproductive timer.

In addition, Super Mario World isn't as nonlinear as it looks in the map. Most paths in the game are still one-track, there's not all that much branching paths. Its world map is a bit more dynamic than say, Super Mario Bros. 3's or New Super Mario Bros. but it wasn't like a highly explorative one. I think U attempted to recapture it but not sure why it didn't succeed as much as World did.

On a side note, I think gaming mags and game journalists and social media needs to stop lionizing video games, because it leads to this rather toxic mentality that you can't express an opposing opinion on a game that's otherwise critically acclaimed, because there's something "wrong" with you for not liking this video game as much as this other video game. You shouldn't be afraid to state that you like New Super Mario Bros. U more than the likes of 3 and World, because it's fine. I like Yoshi's New Island more than Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island for similar reasons: I like the modern conveniences in New Island that the original lacks because it was a product of its time. The original IS still a fine damn good game however and I don't mean to disparage it and I understand where New Island took all of its inspiration from, it's just that I prefer New Island more as a more fun game overall because it was built upon that strong foundation.

Hi Redshift. Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed and extensive reply. Your comments on the SMW and Yoshi's New Island games are a validation of what I was trying to say in my post -new games tend to be better. Of course, there's always going to be a lot of subjectivity here since -as you stated- users evaluate a game based on their experience playing it.

Your comment on professional game critics got me thinking though. I think what might actually be happening is that -since everyone knows that new games are obviously better- the only way they can differentiate themselves from the rest is by adding all their subjective flavor into the analysis. Again, arguing how revolutionary, innovative, or impactful a game was is something they can do to shuffle the "objective" order in which games should otherwise be ranked. This is -of course- pure speculation on my part.

I'm honestly hoping for someone to reply by taking the other side of the argument. Someone who tells me SMW is definitely better than NSMBU for x, y, and z reasons. We'll see what happens.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply!

 

[Ray Trace]

Yeah, pretty much all of your opinions regarding a game is decided on your past experience with games, and maybe how long the gap was between trying out genres. I'm going to bring up New Island again, but that was like, the first Yoshi's Island I seriously wanted to play through (I didn't play GBA Yoshi's Island that much, same with DS) so to me, a lot of the stuff I'm experiencing was new. I also think it's excellent to compare it to New Super Mario Bros. games: both are like, modern iterations of classic titles and both come with modern improvements and refinements that make them worthwhile to play, especially to newcomers of the series. Plus you can mod Yoshi's New Island to replace its kazoo-laden soundtrack entirely, which is probably the weakest aspect of New Island. I guess that plays a factor on how much I like New Island but I don't think it's possible to mod the original's one because it uses MiDi rather than music tracks. New Super Mario Bros. DS has a good world map, an improvement over Super Mario Bros. 3 and it has more polished levels (hearing about that one castle level in 3 make me extremely reluctant to play through it to begin with.)

Plus, while the games today might be easier, with New Island always guiding you with coins and whatnot, I think that's just what happens when you get more knowledgeable about what players like and what players don't like. Yoshi's New Island occasionally gives you red eggs, for example, as opposed to the original, and I think it's better that way, especially in enclosed rooms where you don't have to waste eggs attempting to grab them after ricocheting off walls and spawn camping enemies just to refill your stars. Those Chomps in one level in the original came at almost a ridiculous speed that can be difficult to predict and while New Island is a bit on the slow side, it does get trickier to platform when they do appear later in the game.

Again, arguing how revolutionary, innovative, or impactful a game was is something they can do to shuffle the "objective" order in which games should otherwise be ranked. This is -of course- pure speculation on my part.

In my honest opinion, a game's legacy plays very little, if any enjoyment I have in a game. It simply does not contribute to a game being fun nowadays. Some people DO take their legacy into account when they talk about enjoying a game, but I don't. If a game isn't fun to play, it's just not fun to play. Super Mario Bros. may have set a fine example for platformers, but I'd much rather be playing New Super Mario Bros. Wii or Rayman Legends any time of the week over it. I don't like restarting from the beginning when you lose all your lives, I have very little patience for games that demand way too much out of a player and punish hard for your mistakes. It's probably a reason I'll never ever play a Souls-Like but I suppose I'm going off tangent lol.

I'm honestly hoping for someone to reply by taking the other side of the argument. Someone who tells me SMW is definitely better than NSMBU for x, y, and z reasons. We'll see what happens.

For me, I guess I can say why I liked Wii more than U. Freshness did play into account there, 4 player co-op was a new thing and it was implemented beautifully in that game. By the time U rolled around, I had already played Kirby's Return to Dreamland and Rayman Origins and Legends, both games which had more inventive levels and were more creative, while U was just another game. I guess contextualization played a heavy role on why I don't really care much for U as opposed to New Island (we don't have a traditional Yoshi game since DS, and DS had...questionable design choices anyway, and there isn't really much competition out there in the market that can compare to a Yoshi's Island game; U already had 2 and the aforementioned others).

I apologize if I can't really defend World because...honestly, I'm not all that passionate about it. U and World are also on the same level of preference I have for Mario games as a whole. If you want my favorite classic era Mario game, that would be Super Mario Advance aka Super Mario Bros. 2 USA.

 

[zel]

In my honest opinion, a game's legacy plays very little, if any enjoyment I have in a game. It simply does not contribute to a game being fun nowadays. Some people DO take their legacy into account when they talk about enjoying a game, but I don't. If a game isn't fun to play, it's just not fun to play. Super Mario Bros. may have set a fine example for platformers,

ah mood. a really accurate phrase i picked up is like "i respect it more than i like it" and this basically applies to.. most 2d marios tbh. i havent actually played a nsmb and its like whatever. i wanna ramble about dkcs but thats kinda getting off topic

 

[Ray Trace]

ah mood. a really accurate phrase i picked up is like "i respect it more than i like it" and this basically applies to.. most 2d marios tbh. i havent actually played a nsmb and its like whatever. i like the dkcs muchhhh better

You should try Yoshi's Island at some point, I think you'll like it!

 

[Vivian]

Super Mario World has so many issues today. One of its biggest problems is that it attempts to encourage exploration, but the timer walls you up every single time you want to find a secret exit, probably forcing you to do multiple playthroughs of levels because you can't do levels at your own pace,

I'm having this exact issue with Wario Land.

As for the ranking, my only three disagreements are,

• 3D World would go above Galaxy 2
• Sunshine would go above 64
• 3D Land would go inbetween Sunshine and 64

 

[Lartisan]

Yeah, pretty much all of your opinions regarding a game is decided on your past experience with games, and maybe how long the gap was between trying out genres. I'm going to bring up New Island again, but that was like, the first Yoshi's Island I seriously wanted to play through (I didn't play GBA Yoshi's Island that much, same with DS) so to me, a lot of the stuff I'm experiencing was new. I also think it's excellent to compare it to New Super Mario Bros. games: both are like, modern iterations of classic titles and both come with modern improvements and refinements that make them worthwhile to play, especially to newcomers of the series. Plus you can mod Yoshi's New Island to replace its kazoo-laden soundtrack entirely, which is probably the weakest aspect of New Island. I guess that plays a factor on how much I like New Island but I don't think it's possible to mod the original's one because it uses MiDi rather than music tracks. New Super Mario Bros. DS has a good world map, an improvement over Super Mario Bros. 3 and it has more polished levels (hearing about that one castle level in 3 make me extremely reluctant to play through it to begin with.)

Plus, while the games today might be easier, with New Island always guiding you with coins and whatnot, I think that's just what happens when you get more knowledgeable about what players like and what players don't like. Yoshi's New Island occasionally gives you red eggs, for example, as opposed to the original, and I think it's better that way, especially in enclosed rooms where you don't have to waste eggs attempting to grab them after ricocheting off walls and spawn camping enemies just to refill your stars. Those Chomps in one level in the original came at almost a ridiculous speed that can be difficult to predict and while New Island is a bit on the slow side, it does get trickier to platform when they do appear later in the game.



In my honest opinion, a game's legacy plays very little, if any enjoyment I have in a game. It simply does not contribute to a game being fun nowadays. Some people DO take their legacy into account when they talk about enjoying a game, but I don't. If a game isn't fun to play, it's just not fun to play. Super Mario Bros. may have set a fine example for platformers, but I'd much rather be playing New Super Mario Bros. Wii or Rayman Legends any time of the week over it. I don't like restarting from the beginning when you lose all your lives, I have very little patience for games that demand way too much out of a player and punish hard for your mistakes. It's probably a reason I'll never ever play a Souls-Like but I suppose I'm going off tangent lol.



For me, I guess I can say why I liked Wii more than U. Freshness did play into account there, 4 player co-op was a new thing and it was implemented beautifully in that game. By the time U rolled around, I had already played Kirby's Return to Dreamland and Rayman Origins and Legends, both games which had more inventive levels and were more creative, while U was just another game. I guess contextualization played a heavy role on why I don't really care much for U as opposed to New Island (we don't have a traditional Yoshi game since DS, and DS had...questionable design choices anyway, and there isn't really much competition out there in the market that can compare to a Yoshi's Island game; U already had 2 and the aforementioned others).

I apologize if I can't really defend World because...honestly, I'm not all that passionate about it. U and World are also on the same level of preference I have for Mario games as a whole. If you want my favorite classic era Mario game, that would be Super Mario Advance aka Super Mario Bros. 2 USA.

Hah! I was just going to ask for your opinion on SMB2 and Super Mario 3D World. I honestly loved and still love all the traditional 2D Mario games (i.e. up to SMW). I played them tirelessly and thoroughly and I was able to master them completely. But that was almost 30 years ago. For the last 25 years, I pretty much missed on all the action that went on video game wise. I wanted to get back to it 10 years ago when I bought a Wii and an XBOX 360 (which were both already old at the time). But somehow life (and, especially, my 3 little kids) prevented me from really enjoying them. Now, I just bought a Switch (which I wanted to buy ever since it came out) and I'm absolutely loving it. I packed it with all the games that I like and I get the chance to play it a lot more since it's portable. Anywho, the point is that I missed on a lot of the sequential action that went on between the releases of the Wii and the Switch. The more I read, the more I realize that the problem with the NSMBU game was timing. For most people, it just felt like yet another New Super Mario game that came out for the least successful console Nintendo ever released. However, my point of view is completely different than most people's. My reference was still SMW. So, you can probably understand now why I think like I do. Just the graphs and sound quality make a HUGE difference.

Also, the first few sentences in the paragraph above explain why I have 0 interest in replaying any of those traditional 2D Mario games. I exhausted them and, to me, are just part of the past. I agree 100% with you regarding SMB1.

Regarding SMB2...I love the game! It's just that I'm not sure if it really belongs to the core Mario games. One of the purposes of creating those rankings above was to be as precise as possible when defining the criteria for games to be included or not. That's the reason why I didn't not include Yoshi's Island -which is game I absolutely love with all my heart. In fact, that led me to buy the new Yoshi's Crafted World -though I do have some reservations on this one.

 

[Lartisan]

I'm having this exact issue with Wario Land.

As for the ranking, my only three disagreements are,

• 3D World would go above Galaxy 2
• Sunshine would go above 64
• 3D Land would go inbetween Sunshine and 64

Right. Like I mentioned in my original post, I did not really know what to do exactly with SM3DW. I totally understand Sunshine > 64. But then 3D Land would have to go on a different ranking since it's not a TV console game. Thanks for replying!

 

[zel]

You should try Yoshi's Island at some point, I think you'll like it!

i have played yi snes in late 2019 and havent really played it since i beaet it so i dont have much of an opinion on it at the moment. i did play a minute of it last september but just kinda decided i didnt want to after falling into a pit because im not used to how heavy yoshi feels in comparison to the kongs in the dkcs
ill def get to it Eventually

 

[Ray Trace]

Hah! I was just going to ask for your opinion on SMB2 and Super Mario 3D World. I honestly loved and still love all the traditional 2D Mario games (i.e. up to SMW).

Also, the first few sentences in the paragraph above explain why I have 0 interest in replaying any of those traditional 2D Mario games. I exhausted them and, to me, are just part of the past. I agree 100% with you regarding SMB1.

Regarding SMB2...I love the game! It's just that I'm not sure if it really belongs to the core Mario games. One of the purposes of creating those rankings above was to be as precise as possible when defining the criteria for games to be included or not. That's the reason why I didn't not include Yoshi's Island -which is game I absolutely love with all my heart. In fact, that led me to buy the new Yoshi's Crafted World -though I do have some reservations on this one.

3D World ranks among my favorite 3D Mario platforms, possibly my favorite? One of the reasons I like them both was because I could play as Toad, Mario as a character is too boring and lame in my opinion. Also, Super Mario Bros. 2 has no time limit, so you can take levels at your own pace. Though one of the things that ranks 3D World really high up is that I get to play with my sister together, and there isn't a single player experience that can top that.

 

[Lartisan]

3D World ranks among my favorite 3D Mario platforms, possibly my favorite? One of the reasons I like them both was because I could play as Toad, Mario as a character is too boring and lame in my opinion. Also, Super Mario Bros. 2 has no time limit, so you can take levels at your own pace. Though one of the things that ranks 3D World really high up is that I get to play with my sister together, and there isn't a single player experience that can top that.

All great reasons! I pre-ordered 3D World for switch and I'm really looking forward to that release date