"I heard you have a dragon problem?" (Chapter 50 / 50) It is done!

Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

without a spirit, you're dead

that's the whole idea of harry's death

he actually died and went to see dumbledore
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Are we still talking about Hairy Potterer? Is the resurrection stone the whatchamacallitiforgotabout that rips people's souls out of the afterlife against their will and dooms them to a cursed half-existence full of pain and torment unless it's used with the intent of the effect being temporary?

My memory of deadly hallows is foggy, I repressed most of it.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Well in that case DF is right, because that thing doesn't actually resurrect people. It just plays a cruel prank on the souls of the deceased.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Priam said:
without a spirit, you're dead

that's the whole idea of harry's death

he actually died and went to see dumbledore
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Naw, he was just dreaming and Dumbledore was just communicating through him.

You know, for a British wizard, you don't know a lot about Harry Potter :P

Gabumon said:
Are we still talking about Hairy Potterer? Is the resurrection stone the whatchamacallitiforgotabout that rips people's souls out of the afterlife against their will and dooms them to a cursed half-existence full of pain and torment unless it's used with the intent of the effect being temporary?

My memory of deadly hallows is foggy, I repressed most of it.
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Yeah that's pretty accurate. Easily the most cheap of the gifts.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

There's only one way to solve this

Monty Python Sketch

He's not pining! He's passed on! This potter is no more! He has ceased to be! He's expired and gone to meet his maker! He's a stiff! Bereft of life, he rests in peace! If you hadn't nailed him to the perch he'd be pushing up the daisies! His metabolic processes are now history! He's off the twig! He's kicked the bucket, he's shuffled off his mortal coil, run down the curtain and joined the bleedin' choir invisibile!!He's fuckin' snuffed it!..... THIS IS AN EX-POTTER!!
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Gabumon said:
My memory of deadly hallows is foggy, I repressed most of it.
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My brain is struggling to recall... I think I remember... a lot of boring walking around and characters dying for no reason?

It's a horrible image. I must be mistaken.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Yup, there definitely were a lot of pointless deaths. So many that somewhere around the end I was completely unable to feel anything for any of them because the anticlimactic demises of half of the cast left me completely jaded.

There's a golden rule in fiction writing that the first few scenes of your work should be representative of what your audience can expect from the whole. Deathly Hallows excels at following this rule, because right the first death is so pointless it perfectly sets the stage for everything that follows.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Plus the finale with Voldemort was awful and Harry talked him to death for four pages before firing one spell and ending the whole thing.

Thanks. I'm glad I read seven giant books to get to this point.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Here's a list of characters who die in Deathly Hallows. Yeah, it got excessive.

Charity Burbage
Hedwig
Mad Eye Moody
Rufus Scrimgeour
Gregorovitch
Bathilda Bagshot
Gellert Grindelwald
Peter Pettigrew
Dobby
Crabbe
Fred
Lupin
Tonks
Lavender Brown
Colin Creevey
Snape
Nagini
Bellatrix
Voldemort

Like what the hell Rowling?
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

GalacticPetey said:
Here's a list of characters who die in Deathly Hallows. Yeah, it got excessive.

Charity Burbage
Hedwig
Mad Eye Moody
Rufus Scrimgeour
Gregorovitch
Bathilda Bagshot
Gellert Grindelwald
Peter Pettigrew
Dobby
Crabbe
Fred
Lupin
Tonks
Lavender Brown
Colin Creevey
Snape
Nagini
Bellatrix
Voldemort

Like what the hell Rowling?
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Hedwig dying was complete BS. So was Madeye and Dobby.

Along with Tonks and Lupin.

Also cannot forget Fred, like seriously?????

Also, I am still sore that Sirius Black was killed, especially so early after his introduction.

tl;dr, Rowling turned into George R R Martin.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

how do you kill off fred but not george? they're inseparable.

what kind of sick monster just kills one and lets the other live to bury the body? it's the cruelest punishment imaginable.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

And I'm Javert said:
how do you kill off fred but not george? they're inseparable.

what kind of sick monster just kills one and lets the other live to bury the body? it's the cruelest punishment imaginable.
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You know, I was thinking the same thing.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

waiwaiwait they killed VOLDEMORT?!?!?!?!??????!??!!? :eek:


voldemort was the guy who set the whole plot into motion if you kill him the series will end GAH
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

spoiler alert: the main villain is defeated, usually dead

this is a spoiler for almost every series ever
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

GalacticPetey said:
Here's a list of characters who die in Deathly Hallows. Yeah, it got excessive.

Hedwig
Mad Eye Moody
Rufus Scrimgeour
Dobby
Fred
Lupin
Tonks

Like what the hell Rowling?
Click to expand...
I removed the characters that either posed an important death or were just obscure enough to have no reason to stay alive, but I honestly feel that these characters should have survived.

Headwig's death was just so meaningless, and after being such a major symbol in the potter universe, having her die was just the end of the series right there. Frankly, if it wasn't for the handful of characters that made the series watchable, I almost wouldn't be able to forgive Rowling's betrayal here.

Mad-Eye Moody was said to be the most fantastic and powerful auror of all time. So why did he die? Well, apparently he wasn't able to see Mundungus Fletcher, a clear con-man and absolute coward disappearing, and wouldn't have been able to save himself in time from the killing curse. It's near impossible to deflect the curse, sure, but that doesn't mean that Mad-Eye was just stuck in one damn place the entire battle, I mean he was on a broom, he had the power to do something about it, if Harry can perform Priori Incantartem with Voldemort, surely Mad-Eye can do so with other wizards too. Just doesn't make sense either way. He didn't have to die, and would have to be one of the least possible characters to die in the first place.

Rufus Scrimgeour, though he was put in place as a character who was basically invented to die, really shouldn't have died. He had the hero's way out, but there was so much more he could have done. If Rowling didn't decide to go on a bloody killing spree, then perhaps we would be able to see what kind of minister he was really. In the movies, his death was just suddenly announced after we had about two seconds of screen time with Bill Fucking Nighy in the role. At the very least, make the hostile takeover of the Ministry some sort of Impirius curse or something, don't just bring in the Michael Sheen lookalike as a replacement for a character who would have a similar role. Pius Thickneese's role is basically the same as Rufus' role, some sort of Ministry higher power, so why not include Rufus being imperiused? Would have made for a better and more tragic plotline, avoiding the killing sprees.

Dobby appeared in two of the movies, and, though I haven't read the books, this must mean that he only appeared with a substantial role in these two books as well. So why kill him off? A sweet character like him was invented, brought back, and killed off to compensate as a "tug on the heartstrings" character. You have him play a major role in one story, then retire him for a whole 4 fucking books, then bring him back randomly in the last one to "save the heroes". At the very least he deserved to live. His death was unjustified, unreasonable, and downright unlucky. The moment he returns to Harry's life, and he's killed instantly, which not only pissed off the characters, but enraged the fandom too. This dwarf should not have died.

Fred's death was in there to remind us that anyone can die. That's teaching us a life lesson, sure, but NEVER BREAK UP THE COMEDY RELIEF DUO. It makes no sense, literally rips the comedy out, and for some stupid reason, they don't even have enough time to mourn before forgetting all about them and carrying on with their lives. You could have killed off Percy, he was a fine candidate for a Weasley death, the one who decided that his job was more important than his family or friends, going so far as to be one of the arresting officers for "Dumbledore's Army", and only returning to the Weasley family after it became evidently clear that the Ministry has gone batshit insane. Percy was the more likely Weasley to die. I wouldn't approve, but I'd approve it better if he died in the place of Fred.

I'm going to pair these two together as a couple for this bit - Lupin and Tonks. At least one of them should have survived. Preferably both, because at least then, Teddy Lupin, their child, would have grown up with a proper parent. Sure, he lived with his Grandmother for most of his life, and sure, he had a friend in the Potters, but what happens when dear old Grandmother Tonks suddenly dies of a heart attack? He'll become an orphan again, just like Harry. But yeah, Harry's his godfather and all, but that doesn't make much of a difference to the fact that Teddy is left without a family. So kill one of them, Rowling, by all means, this still upholds the law that anyone can die, but you seriously expect us to suddenly agree with the deaths of both of his parents, leaving him an exact parallel of Harry Potter? And, like Mad-Eye's excuse, both Lupin and Tonks were bloody amazing wizards. At least one of them would have survived the battle, it's not that hard to see the evidence when it's been written solid by yourself!

I'll also explain why some of the wizards and witches who got killed are on my list of characters that shouldn't really have avoided their deaths.

We'll start with the more obvious - Severus Snape. I'm not here to say that he was such a small character with such a minor role that he should have died because of that, or that he was an awful character and all that shit. It's purely because his usefulness had frankly run its course. He played a substantial role as the one who basically infiltrated Voldemort's army and turned things around on themselves, due to some sort of insane but brilliant plan concocted by Dumbledore, all the while helping the heroes take down voldemort and his horcruxes, but the truth is, after all of that, after the war had already started, and after Harry, Ron and Hermione had already found and destroyed all but three of the horcruxes, what next? Only on his deathbed would he finally do something useful, and explain everything to Harry. Don't get me wrong, he was one of my absolute favourite characters in the series, his heroism knows no bounds, but the truth is that Voldemort was basically defeated, Lily died a long time ago, and Voldemort would have disposed of him anyway, so his part in the story was essentially over. It was going to happen anyway, due to Snape killing Dumbledore, and Voldemort's absolute stupidity got the better of Snape, but even on his deathbed, Snape's final act was to tell Harry everything - about how he himself is a horcrux, how Dumbledore asked him to murder him, and how he needed to sneak into Voldemort's army in the first place. And even then, even if Snape did survive the battle, at what point would he have been able to defect from Voldemort's army in the first place? He would have stood beside Voldemort, albeit unwillingly, and would have likely been killed by one of the other students. If he survived that, then he would have earned himself a place in Azkaban for certain. Snape literally had nothing else to live for. And he had a perfect death in the end anyway, true to his loyalties right to the very end.

Peter Pettigrew, though he apparently defected from Voldemort in the end, deserved to die. Everything he did, such as selling the potters out to the dark lord, sending Black away to azkaban for all those years, even resurrecting him all by his lonesome, all of this played a substantial role in the rise of Voldemort and the events that followed. He was essentially the puppet master throughout all of this, while being described as a lowly servant to the Dark lord. His hand apparently turned on him and choked him to death - a death rather fitting of someone so loathsome. He betrayed his friends, he turned to the shadows, he murdered innocent people, this man deserved death more than any other on this list.

Voldemort, of course he had to die! He was the whole reason this series started. His neo-nazi views weren't going to suddenly change at the last minute. That's the only way he could have possibly survived the events of this book. The whole reason for his death is the whole premise of this book. His death was the making of this book, the very climax of this series, he was the very reason we had Harry Potter.

Bellatrix was a high supporter of Voldemort right to the very end, if she wasn't killed by Molly, then she would have been killed by the hundreds of other people lining up to kill her. I'm pretty sure everyone was finished with her shit after she killed Sirius Black. Frankly I wouldn't be surprised if half the people out there were on a manhunt for her. She deserved her death, she was loyal to Voldemort right to the very end, even when it was apparently clear that they had lost, laughing while she did it.

Nagini was one of the Horcruxes, again, the only way she could have survived is if Voldemort changed his ways, or if she somehow got control of the Resurrection stone, which I don't think either was even remotely possible. She had to die in the end.

Crabbe was a thorough jackass throughout the series, even to the point where he was egging on a clearly uncomfortable Draco to kill Harry and his friends. Though he was influenced by his other friends, his father, and his house, and the blame wasn't placed too much on him, his death still proved that the inexperienced allies of Voldemort would die just like anyone else. He deserved his death.

Lavender had added one major part to the overall plot, and that was being Ron's girlfriend in the Halfblood Prince. Frankly she didn't really pose much of a major character as to someone who should have survived. She was inexperienced, much like the rest of the army, and if she didn't die, then anyone else would have, too. She really was a random death at the very most. Admittedly random deaths aren't exactly the best way to handle things in the Harry Potter universe, but it was either her or another notable student, so it didn't exactly matter too much.

Colin Creevey has much of the same attributes as Lavender, but he had the added issue of being an annoying little prick. I think he was purely one fanboy of Harry's, and got petrified as part of the plotpoint of the Chamber of Secrets. Any other character could have been petrified, Rowling just decided to bring in Colin. He didn't play much of a role in future installments, having his role so substantially reduced that his character and his character's brother in the films were simply replaced with Nigel, whom was actually pretty damn cool. I say good riddance to Colin, really. His situation is similar to dobby's, but with the expense that his role was replaceable.

Gellert Grindlewald was really just the bit character to explain a fair bit of Dumbledore's background and the Elder wand. His death didn't really affect the character's journey, so I say fuck it, why not.

Gregorovitch was similar to Grindlewald, in the essence that he didn't play much of a large role. It also seems like he was supposed to be some sort of replacement for Ollivander? Not sure what role he really played, but it can't have been that big in the end anyway.

Charity Burbage was introduced in the exact scene that she died in in the movies, so she can't have made too much of an impact in the books either. She's no Mcgonagall or Snape, she was really just invented to show Voldemort's prejudice against muggles (as she was the teacher of muggle studies), she was disposable.

I'm not too familiar with the books, as I said before, but like Charity Burbage, Bathilda Bagshot mustn't have had a very large role in the events if her scene in the movies was so damn small. She was an old bird either way, so if her body wasn't already inhabited by Nagini, I'm fairly certain she would have died a couple of minutes later anyways. Disposable. I guess the same could have been said for Scrimgeour, but the fact with him was that his role was taken over by someone exactly like him. I see no need for it, just kick pious out or at least make him a much more minor character.

And finally, the one character who should have died but didn't,

Dolores Umbridge, my favourite villain in this series, purely due to her complete evil nature. She was a bitch, hated more than Voldermort, Wormtail, Bellatrix and the Malfoys all in one. The question has to be raised: Why did she survive? She didn't have much else to add to the story, and everyone wanted her dead, so why not make her bite the dust, kick the bucket, cease to be? Why, Rowling? You kill off all of these other characters, but not her, just why, Rowling? Why? Why? WHY? WHY COULDN'T YOU JUST DO IT?!!! WHY?!!!!! WHY?!!!!!! WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY?!!!!!!!
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

I didn't care overly much about most of the HP7 deaths.

Like, for Hedwig my reaction was "what?!" Mad-Eye was "lol WHAT?!" and then the rest were non-reactions until Fred, and then I bawled my eyes out. Then Lupin and Tonks and Colin were dead and I was just like "uh wow, overkill much?", and then Harry died and I was like "ohhh yeah", but then he wasn't dead and I was like "oh, way to have your cake and eat it too, J.K." and then it made sense that Bellatrix and Voldy died (and Snape before them).

I watched an interview where Rowing said she threw in Lupin dying with Tonks to emphasize that war is horrible and leaves kids orphaned and shit, just like Harry before, and maybe if Fred's death didn't overshadow everything else for me, I could appreciate that more, but I can't, because Fred was awesome and he shouldn't have died and all the other random good-guys deaths in the climax just meant nothing to me after him.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Priam said:
Mad-Eye Moody was said to be the most fantastic and powerful auror of all time. So why did he die? Well, apparently he wasn't able to see Mundungus Fletcher, a clear con-man and absolute coward disappearing, and wouldn't have been able to save himself in time from the killing curse. It's near impossible to deflect the curse, sure, but that doesn't mean that Mad-Eye was just stuck in one damn place the entire battle, I mean he was on a broom, he had the power to do something about it, if Harry can perform Priori Incantartem with Voldemort, surely Mad-Eye can do so with other wizards too. Just doesn't make sense either way. He didn't have to die, and would have to be one of the least possible characters to die in the first place.
Click to expand...
That phenomenon doesn't work that way. It occurs when two wands with matching cores fight each other. Both Harry and Tom have a Phoenix tail feather core, incidentally from the same bird, Fawkes. When used as a 'regular' spell, it simply shows the most recently used spells used by the wand it is aimed at. Pretty useless in combat, you can hear them scream their spells, and even if they just say their spells mentally, it will be apparent what spell it is by color and/or impact.

Priam said:
Dobby appeared in two of the movies, and, though I haven't read the books, this must mean that he only appeared with a substantial role in these two books as well. So why kill him off? A sweet character like him was invented, brought back, and killed off to compensate as a "tug on the heartstrings" character. You have him play a major role in one story, then retire him for a whole 4 fucking books, then bring him back randomly in the last one to "save the heroes". At the very least he deserved to live. His death was unjustified, unreasonable, and downright unlucky. The moment he returns to Harry's life, and he's killed instantly, which not only pissed off the characters, but enraged the fandom too. This dwarf should not have died.
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He appears in Book 4 where it is apparent he works a paid job on Hogwarts. He is the only one who wants to clean the Gryffindor common room after Hermione is placing clothes there to free elves (she's started a club for house-elf rights). He also is the one that gave Harry the underwater breath weeds, instead of Neville (he acquired them in a not-so-legitimate way though). He shows the Room of Requirement in Book 6 instead of, again, Neville. He also plays spy in that book.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Lakituthequick said:
Priam said:
Mad-Eye Moody was said to be the most fantastic and powerful auror of all time. So why did he die? Well, apparently he wasn't able to see Mundungus Fletcher, a clear con-man and absolute coward disappearing, and wouldn't have been able to save himself in time from the killing curse. It's near impossible to deflect the curse, sure, but that doesn't mean that Mad-Eye was just stuck in one damn place the entire battle, I mean he was on a broom, he had the power to do something about it, if Harry can perform Priori Incantartem with Voldemort, surely Mad-Eye can do so with other wizards too. Just doesn't make sense either way. He didn't have to die, and would have to be one of the least possible characters to die in the first place.
Click to expand...
That phenomenon doesn't work that way. It occurs when two wands with matching cores fight each other. Both Harry and Tom have a Phoenix tail feather core, incidentally from the same bird, Fawkes. When used as a 'regular' spell, it simply shows the most recently used spells used by the wand it is aimed at. Pretty useless in combat, you can hear them scream their spells, and even if they just say their spells mentally, it will be apparent what spell it is by color and/or impact.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, I remember that now. Voldemort said something about it in the Deathly Hallows, and I think Dumbledore might have mentioned it, too. What I don't understand is that Harry and Voldemort did the same thing right at the very end of the Deathly Hallows, when Harry was using Draco's wand and Voldemort was using the Elder wand. Unless they used the same core, I don't understand how they managed to perform the same phenomenon. It's possible that the wands have the same core, but it's highly unlikely and coincidental that this would ever happen.

Lakituthequick said:
Priam said:
Dobby appeared in two of the movies, and, though I haven't read the books, this must mean that he only appeared with a substantial role in these two books as well. So why kill him off? A sweet character like him was invented, brought back, and killed off to compensate as a "tug on the heartstrings" character. You have him play a major role in one story, then retire him for a whole 4 fucking books, then bring him back randomly in the last one to "save the heroes". At the very least he deserved to live. His death was unjustified, unreasonable, and downright unlucky. The moment he returns to Harry's life, and he's killed instantly, which not only pissed off the characters, but enraged the fandom too. This dwarf should not have died.
Click to expand...
He appears in Book 4 where it is apparent he works a paid job on Hogwarts. He is the only one who wants to clean the Gryffindor common room after Hermione is placing clothes there to free elves (she's started a club for house-elf rights). He also is the one that gave Harry the underwater breath weeds, instead of Neville (he acquired them in a not-so-legitimate way though). He shows the Room of Requirement in Book 6 instead of, again, Neville. He also plays spy in that book.
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I suppose his appearances in those books weren't notable enough for him to appear in the movies, then. Frankly I wish that Rowling had just chosen the characters well. The fact is that he was a major character in one movie, then demoted so easily, appearing randomly in places. Then JK has him jump back up to a higher character, before suddenly killing him. And he was so sweet. It just doesn't make much sense to me.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Priam said:
Lakituthequick said:
Priam said:
Mad-Eye Moody was said to be the most fantastic and powerful auror of all time. So why did he die? Well, apparently he wasn't able to see Mundungus Fletcher, a clear con-man and absolute coward disappearing, and wouldn't have been able to save himself in time from the killing curse. It's near impossible to deflect the curse, sure, but that doesn't mean that Mad-Eye was just stuck in one damn place the entire battle, I mean he was on a broom, he had the power to do something about it, if Harry can perform Priori Incantartem with Voldemort, surely Mad-Eye can do so with other wizards too. Just doesn't make sense either way. He didn't have to die, and would have to be one of the least possible characters to die in the first place.
Click to expand...
That phenomenon doesn't work that way. It occurs when two wands with matching cores fight each other. Both Harry and Tom have a Phoenix tail feather core, incidentally from the same bird, Fawkes. When used as a 'regular' spell, it simply shows the most recently used spells used by the wand it is aimed at. Pretty useless in combat, you can hear them scream their spells, and even if they just say their spells mentally, it will be apparent what spell it is by color and/or impact.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, I remember that now. Voldemort said something about it in the Deathly Hallows, and I think Dumbledore might have mentioned it, too. What I don't understand is that Harry and Voldemort did the same thing right at the very end of the Deathly Hallows, when Harry was using Draco's wand and Voldemort was using the Elder wand. Unless they used the same core, I don't understand how they managed to perform the same phenomenon. It's possible that the wands have the same core, but it's highly unlikely and coincidental that this would ever happen.
Click to expand...
Voldemort was using the Elder Wand, correct, but Harry was the owner of it. This particular wand can't be used against its owner, or at least not effectively.
 
Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

Lakituthequick said:
Priam said:
Lakituthequick said:
Priam said:
Mad-Eye Moody was said to be the most fantastic and powerful auror of all time. So why did he die? Well, apparently he wasn't able to see Mundungus Fletcher, a clear con-man and absolute coward disappearing, and wouldn't have been able to save himself in time from the killing curse. It's near impossible to deflect the curse, sure, but that doesn't mean that Mad-Eye was just stuck in one damn place the entire battle, I mean he was on a broom, he had the power to do something about it, if Harry can perform Priori Incantartem with Voldemort, surely Mad-Eye can do so with other wizards too. Just doesn't make sense either way. He didn't have to die, and would have to be one of the least possible characters to die in the first place.
Click to expand...
That phenomenon doesn't work that way. It occurs when two wands with matching cores fight each other. Both Harry and Tom have a Phoenix tail feather core, incidentally from the same bird, Fawkes. When used as a 'regular' spell, it simply shows the most recently used spells used by the wand it is aimed at. Pretty useless in combat, you can hear them scream their spells, and even if they just say their spells mentally, it will be apparent what spell it is by color and/or impact.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, I remember that now. Voldemort said something about it in the Deathly Hallows, and I think Dumbledore might have mentioned it, too. What I don't understand is that Harry and Voldemort did the same thing right at the very end of the Deathly Hallows, when Harry was using Draco's wand and Voldemort was using the Elder wand. Unless they used the same core, I don't understand how they managed to perform the same phenomenon. It's possible that the wands have the same core, but it's highly unlikely and coincidental that this would ever happen.
Click to expand...
Voldemort was using the Elder Wand, correct, but Harry was the owner of it. This particular wand can't be used against its owner, or at least not effectively.
Click to expand...
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Re: "I heard you have a dragon problem?"

This thread turned into a Harry Potter characters deaths talk.
 
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