Who are you voting for (or would vote for if you could)?

[PrinceLarryKoopa88]

I'd definitely vote libertarian because nowadays, republicans are democrats and democrats are socialists, and libertarians are *becoming* republicans.

I think we should have taken George Washington's advice against political parties.

Democrats aren't socialist; Bernie is only a "democratic socialist" and the Democratic establishment is behind Hillary who is really more of a left-centrist in my books.

I agree that we should have took Washington's advice. Hopefully in the future, the country will realize the corruption of the parties.

 

[Meta Knight]

Actually the founding fathers didn't think you should be able to vote at all. Or me, or most Americans.

 

[Magikrazy]

Libertarians mainly advocate for personal freedoms, which goes from [...] to freedom of choosing your gender...

people choose their gender?

Not unless you're a clam or an oyster or whatever mollusk does that.

 

[freakworld]

I don't know about you but I sexually identify as an attack helicopter.

 

[Specific Neptune]

I don't know about you but I sexually identify as an attack helicopter.

And I, sir, a Lemon.

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

I often don't agree with libertarians on many, many subjects though there are a few subjects I agree (such as abortion). For instance, opposition to vaccinations and motorcycle helmets in the name of personal freedom is a very dangerous libertarian stance with virtually no gain.

 

[Shyghoul]

I never understood the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to do anything negative to yourself" thing. it's my body, not yours.

 

[Ray Trace]

If you get hospitalized because you didn't wear a seatbelt in an accident, guess who pays for it? That's right, tax payers. And when you harm yourself in a way that can be easily preventable, you also hurt your family members and other community members emotionally.

Also, not getting vaccinations hurts everyone since it compromises herd immunity and it hurts people who can't get vaccinations due to medical complications.

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

I never understood the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to do anything negative to yourself" thing. it's my body, not yours.

Why do we have to wear seatbelts then?

 

[Kerrigan]

I never understood the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to do anything negative to yourself" thing. it's my body, not yours.

Why do we have to wear seatbelts then?

Because the government decided they had to take care of us, and so they made a law that really shouldn't be there. Seatbelts are common sense for some people.

 

[Specific Neptune]

I never understood the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to do anything negative to yourself" thing. it's my body, not yours.

if you hurt yourself on purpose, it doesn't just affect you, it affects the people around you who love you


so don't hurt yourself please, or i will get very very sad and you don't want to make me sad

you wouldn't like me when i'm sad

EDIT: didn't see blof's post there, but we're basically saying the same thing

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

Because the government decided they had to take care of us, and so they made a law that really shouldn't be there. Seatbelts are common sense for some people.

In the context of seatbelts, you believe menial freedom is worth the cost of of human lives, resources, and disability?

 

[Kerrigan]

Because the government decided they had to take care of us, and so they made a law that really shouldn't be there. Seatbelts are common sense for some people.

In the context of seatbelts, you believe menial freedom is worth the cost of of human lives, resources, and disability?

...What? When and how did I imply that?

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

This is your response to my question

I never understood the whole "you shouldn't be allowed to do anything negative to yourself" thing. it's my body, not yours.

Why do we have to wear seatbelts then?

Because the government decided they had to take care of us, and so they made a law that really shouldn't be there. Seatbelts are common sense for some people.

Particularly your "so they made a law that really shouldn't be there"

You didn't omit my quote, so I assumed you're responding to my seatbelt point and strongly implied that it's "a law that really shouldn't be there" and your "Seatbelts are common sense for some people" wasn't strong or specific enough to contradict or qualify that claim, if you were attempting that.

Yes, if the law isn't there, rates of people NOT wearing seat belts WILL shoot up. For instance, partial helmet laws are as ineffective as laws that allow helmets. Laws that make seatbelt wearing optional will likely have a negative impact on our public health as rates of people wearing seatbelts go down.

 

[Specific Neptune]

basically ^that

if you take that law away, people will still wear the seatbelts, but eventually begin to question "why we need to wear our seatbelts" if there's no law preventing them from not doing so

sooner or later, people will begin to not wear them, die in crashes, forcing the governments of the world to reinstate the law

the law is there for a reason: so people will know better than to not wear them

it's common sense for most people, for others it's the law, something that they don't understand but do it anyway because of the law

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

Yes, that's why we have enforcement. It looks like personal choice on the surface, but we're all part of a system, so if you're seriously injured, society has to pay. And sometimes, government has to "force" them to do things like wearing a seatbelt. There are libertarians who don't address that part of the argument, and that's why their view sometimes is so dangerous.

I like the idea of personal freedom (who doesn't?), and I don't support government monitoring our phone calls and Google who tracks your web searches (which is why I use duckduckgo, the other reason being I just resent Google nowadays), but there are libertarians who take it way too far like with vaccination and helmet laws.

 

[Kerrigan]

That's why I don't like vaccination and seatbelt laws. They should essentially be common sense. The way it is now is just the government taking care of people, which they shouldn't be doing.

 

[Specific Neptune]

That's why I don't like vaccination and seatbelt laws. They should essentially be common sense. The way it is now is just the government taking care of people, which they shouldn't be doing.

...that's the government's job

that's literally what they're here to do

 

[Ray Trace]

Vaccination should be required because of anti-vaccination idiots who think it's common sense that vaccinations give you autism.

 

[Shyghoul]

If you get hospitalized because you didn't wear a seatbelt in an accident, guess who pays for it? That's right, tax payers. And when you harm yourself in a way that can be easily preventable, you also hurt your family members and other community members emotionally.

Also, not getting vaccinations hurts everyone since it compromises herd immunity and it hurts people who can't get vaccinations due to medical complications.

I find it to be quite stupid that tax payers have to pay for stuff that. as for it emotionally hurting/community family members, I don't believe that someone geting emotionally hurt by something is a good reason to make said thing illegal. like, I get emotionally hurt whenever someone says anything degrading about me, but I still believe they have a right to say it and I certainly don't think those remarks should be outlawed

also my remark wasn't referring to vaccines (since, as you pointed out, not getting those does harm people besides yourself)

Why do we have to wear seat belts then?

b/c it's illegal not to wear them

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

That's why I don't like vaccination and seatbelt laws. They should essentially be common sense. The way it is now is just the government taking care of people, which they shouldn't be doing.

When governments do not mandate vaccines or seatbelts, people will not keep it up. In terms of vaccinations, we will fall below the 90% minimum for effective herd immunity and society suffers from disease outbreaks. In terms of seatbelts, injuries will be more serious and taxpayers will have to pay more for the extra burden on hospitals. It might seem obvious to you, but to others, they don't listen or they're ignorant and they don't vaccinate or use seatbelts or helmets.

On another note, I also think voting should be mandatory and I also think votes being "optional" is the reason for unimpressive voter turnout in the U.S..

I find it to be quite stupid that tax payers have to pay for stuff that. as for it emotionally hurting/community family members, I don't believe that someone geting emotionally hurt by something is a good reason to make said thing illegal. like, I get emotionally hurt whenever someone says anything degrading about me, but I still believe they have a right to say it and I certainly don't think those remarks should be outlawed

Hospitals are public services. Paying taxes funds our public services including schools. Serious injuries require more expenses from the hospitals and hospitals require adequate funds. If they pay more, we'll pay more. This study shows the cost of injuries unhelmeted motorcycle riders receive and this one concludes that "motorcyclists hospitalized from states without universal helmet laws are more likely to die during the hospitalization, sustain severe traumatic brain injury, be discharged to long-term care facilities, and lack private health insurance."

I think it's a bigger problem that more people will have loved ones get incapacitated or even killed all over something minor and preventable as not wearing a helmet or not wearing a seatbelt. You know how devastating auto accidents are. Seatbelts reduce that risk of casualties drastically enough that we need a law that protects people.

 

[Meta Knight]

 

[Shyghoul]

I find it to be quite stupid that tax payers have to pay for stuff that. as for it emotionally hurting/community family members, I don't believe that someone geting emotionally hurt by something is a good reason to make said thing illegal. like, I get emotionally hurt whenever someone says anything degrading about me, but I still believe they have a right to say it and I certainly don't think those remarks should be outlawed

Hospitals are public services. Paying taxes funds our public services including schools. Serious injuries require more expenses from the hospitals and hospitals require adequate funds. If they pay more, we'll pay more. This study shows the cost of injuries unhelmeted motorcycle riders receive and this one concludes that "motorcyclists hospitalized from states without universal helmet laws are more likely to die during the hospitalization, sustain severe traumatic brain injury, be discharged to long-term care facilities, and lack private health insurance."

I think it's a bigger problem that more people will have loved ones get incapacitated or even killed all over something minor and preventable as not wearing a helmet or not wearing a seatbelt. You know how devastating auto accidents are. Seatbelts reduce that risk of casualties drastically enough that we need a law that protects people.

imo the person who didn't wear a seatbelt/helmet/whatever should be the one to fork out the extra money to pay for their more severe injuries. taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for someone's unsafe practices

 

[LeftyGreenMario]

I believe paying a premium for insurance is a provision for those laws, but overall, you will likely be unable to pay for those expenses on your own.

 

[DragonFreak]

imo the person who didn't wear a seatbelt/helmet/whatever should be the one to fork out the extra money to pay for their more severe injuries. taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for someone's unsafe practices

IDK I guess I view tax money and things like this (which also includes things like universal healthcare) as "the community/country helping everyone else out" which form your own opinions if that is good or not.

Besides, it's not like your tax money will go to anything specific that you'd like anyways.